Thanks to all who voted in my earlier code on this subject. The results corrected for one accidental mis-vote were 42% in favor of retention of current codes, including formal nights where applicable. 58% favored all informal on cruises that now have formal nights, thus eliminating formal nights. Formal nights had more support in this poll than the one on Cruise Critic. Though it was worded differently, only about 28% favored mandatory formal nights there.

Based on comments posted about my earlier poll, I'm now setting forth a new proposition regarding evening dress codes, and asking you to vote yes or no on it.

PROPOSITION:

On all cruises WHICH NOW HAVE FORMAL NIGHTS, they would be retained as to all cruises in Europe, the Mediteranian, and Atlantic crossings. Cruises which PRESENTLY DO NOT HAVE FORMAL NIGHTS would remain as they are. There would be NO formal nights in other locations.

Yes?

No?

Thanks,
Richard

Richard, you need to add an "either one is fine with me" choice :)

I really do appreciate that others prefer casual, but I just LOVE to dress up! I tend to ignore the dress code and dress up every night!! <img border="0" alt="[12]" title="" src="graemlins/18.gif" />

Hi again, Sheri!

Like you, I tend to dress above the "casual" level every night, to the point of "informal" (jacket but no tie). I think it's the tie that gives me problems!

Thanks,
Richard :) ;) :)

I don't mind "informal" but its the "formal" nights that bother me since that means packing an entire suit/tuxedo.

You need to add a never have formal :app:

awwww...but Jim, you look so nice in your suit!!!! :)

Jim:

The option of never a formal night was on my earlier poll now residing on the second page of this board. I thought I'd try a different set of options this time, as several expressed interest in formal nights in Europe and on crossings.For what it may be worth, I understand their position. What I don't understand is formal nights on Caribbean cruises, Panama Canal cruises, and the like.

Thanks,
Richard :) :) :)

Richard,

Was there a difference to your poll answers along gender lines? I mean, did more men want fewer formal evenings, and more women want to retain formal evenings?

Just curious. "In general", I read many posts on CC where some of the wives/girlfriends complain that their husbands/boyfriends shy away from dressing up, where the wives/girlfriends seem to enjoy it. Wondering if that showed up in your results here.

I, being female, enjoy dressing up once in awhile so I would probably vote to retain formal nights where they already exist. But, I must admit, our cruise to Alaska in June will only be our second cruise so I do NOT speak from experience!! And there are no formal nights in Alaska.

Ginny
;)

gopack:

As you can see, the actual poll does not show gender of those responding. As far as comments on this and my other poll thread, there seemed to be no gender distinction among either the pro or con formal night.

Thanks,
Richard :) :) :)

Richard,

I guess my question didn't make too much sense!! How could you tell gender from the poll answers?? Dah!

But, like you said, maybe the comments about the poll question would show a difference between the genders. Maybe that is what I was thinking when I asked the question. Yeah, that was it!!

<img border="0" alt="[Hammer]" title="" src="graemlins/hammer.gif" />

Ginny

I've pretty much accepted that Radisson is getting more casual. However, Pat's reports from Navigator raise my concerns. The pendulum might be swinging too far. I would rather put up with hauling tux, dinner jacket, and the formal dresses than end up sailing wiht a bunch of slobs. I might as well be back on RCI. I think a sports coat should be required each evening in Compass Rose just to provide some civility. Shirt sleeves should be reserved for the casual restaurant and bbq on deck.

None of us, except for maybe the Californians and some of the Floridians, would go to a fancy restaurant without a jacket; why should we at sea.

I have sailed Radisson before when it was CCC on Diamond. Dress was all over the place but was decent. I liked the CCC dress code. Bermuda is NOT CCC; it has three informal nights. If Radisson does not enforce informal night dress code here, where will they enforce it?

Off my soapbox...

Formal night
Icky pooh caw caw :ohmy:

Marc, I agree. If they say informal, it is quite clear what the requirements are, jacket, but tie optional. Maybe the Bermuda cruises will be the next CCC full cruise. However, on the Diamond in January in the islands, we had a formal night. In Alaska, I think every other line has formal nights but Radisson.

I agree also with gopack. Most of the "moaning and groaning" about dress code seems to come from men! (at least in my memory of this subject). But then, if I had to wear a tight thing around my neck in hot weather, maybe I wouldn't like it either. There is always talk of extra weight in the bags for formal (from men). For me, my formal stuff is lighter per outfit than ccc, when I may bring a pants suit and blouse instead of one little lightweight silk dress.

Olivia, Bermuda was CCC last year; that may be causing the confusion.

If you cheat and use regular black dress shoes instead of patent leather, formal wear adds maybe two or three pounds for men. It substitutes for one pair of dress pants, one dress shirt, and one sports coat so you are just adding the cumberbund, tie, and hardware.

If you would take one less hard back book and go to library onboard instead, it is probably a wash. I am not too sympathetic to those that blame the airlines for their wish not to have formal nights.

Marc, yes, particularly on international flights, which for my airline allow the full weight (70lbs) even if you are making connections domestically. I don't know that weight restrictions have changed at all, at least for my airline of necessity (USAirways)if I don't want to drive 3 hours to an aiport.

Ah, yes, but not all of us have the good fortune to use only international flights all the way to and from our cruise. We live in the middle of the US, unfortunately. And the 50 lb. weight limit IS applied to us, even if we are connecting to an international flight.

Even on Radisson cruises that were all CCC. I NEVER saw anyone dressed like a slob. My experience has been that 40% to 60% of the men will CHOOSE to wear a jacket anyway. No option in this poll would allow anyone to come to the dining room for dinner in jeans, shorts, grungy "T" shirts, sandals, or any other sub-CCC dress.

Thus far, on all the polls both here and on CC, formal night advocates have been in the minority, maybe averaging 40% Far more than 40% of Radisson cruises include formal nights.

Thanks,
Richard :) :) :)

The thing is, most women like to dress nicely for dinner whether it's informal or even casual but men, including my husband,don't like having to pack the formal gear. He would never go without a jacket to dinner, except in very casual places, but on Radisson, he would go with the formal even though the packing is heavy--but he would definately prefer jacket and tie.

Jean- I agree and Tony decided to wear dark suit instead of tux - he always wears a jacket to dinner...just does not want to cart the tux across the sea- Joanna

I was going to weigh in on this but I have to say that Jean's photo is the coolest yet.

You know, I don't even know where the doggie came from, except it was an email, of course, and I loved it so much I saved it and thanks to Karen she somehow got it put in the right place. She is a genius. (As you know.) Actually, we had a mini poodle.

Karen - superwoman - Joanna

Just out of curiosity, why is packing a dark suit any different than packing a tux? I realize that you need differnt shirts/cummerbund/vest/tie ( not much weight or much space) but black shoes are black shoes.

I'm not coming down on either side of the issue but just asking.

By the way, where does a world cruise/long cruise fit in this scheme?

Peggy

I have finally gotten around to reading this thread.

Marc, since when does casual attire equate to "slob?" I think one can dress casually and be far from slovenly. I would hope common sense would prevail if the dress code eased up.

Personally, I like dressing up every now and then; however, I wear suits and dresses to work each day. When I'm on vacation, I prefer a more casual/informal wardrobe. I also hate schlepping formal attire. The happy medium for me is to bring along a long, black skirt and black dress pants and several really nice tops, along with some nice jewelry to accessorize. Alan has a dark suit that he prefers over a tux.

This is as dressy as we will get on vacation.

Jean, I LOVE your cool dog!

My DH takes a dark navy suit and uses the coat as his blazer. He would still take the coat for his blazer and he would have to take a tux too. So he ops to do the dark suit and leave the tux at home. Less to pack.

Carolyn

Carolyn, makes sense. Saves one jacket and hardware.

Denise, look at canadagal's report from Navigator. We all will dress properly, just seems some of our shipmates are not.

THE LUGGAGE ISSUE:

I don't know if the number of dress codes has an effect on the volume of anyone elses' luggage or not, but here's my story.

For the 14 night VTC (Panama Canal) cruise last month, there were the traditional three codes. Carol and I each took two pieces of checked luggage and our allowed carry ons at or near the size and weight limits imposed by the airlines. Still, we couldn't squeeze in a full two weeks supply of wash and wear items. We figured we'd use the self serve laundries and the ship's laundry if needed. As the ship was 100% full and just comming off the world cruise with some "straglers" still aboard, the self serve laundries were not sufficient to meet demand, so our timing on those was a problem. We had packed for two formal nights as our docs said, but a third one was thrown in on us and the ships laundry was needed so we could attend it both formal and clean! After the first formal night, reservations and space in the non-formal alternative restaurants became very scarce. Apparently "the word" had gotten out to some guests before "Passages" was delivered that a given night would be formal. By the time we got our "Passages" all alternatives (except room service) were gone

And, as were were at or near the limits for checked and carry on luggage, our ability to buy things in the ports was severely limited.

Maybe I am just a poor planner or packer, but this story is indicative of my experience since the airlines reduced luggage allowances.

Thanks
Richard

I have to say that on the Bermuda sailing I did 4/3/04, I saw no "slobs" either on CCC nights or the informal evenings.

Claudia

Claudia:

With as many sailings as Radisson has, it is entirely possible that there could be "slobs" on a few, though I've never seen them on seven Radisson cruises in 2 1/2 years. But all note that "dressing like a slob" for dinner is NOT one of the options in this poll!

Thanks,
Richard :) :) :)

Speaking for myself, I am not concerned how others dress. It's a personal choice and it says something about one who does not dress appropriately and in a decent manor. Everything is subjective. My view of casual/informal is different than someone else's. I can only be responsible for my attire.

If you don't want to be with "slobs," then leave the "slobs" be. The majority will be dressed in an appropriate manner.

No matter which cruise line you sail on, or where you go in the world, there will be those who simply don't care about dressing nicely. It's all a personal choice and everyone is entitled to that. Their vacation, their choice. I don't focus on this at all. I focus on my vacation and my choices.

Denise, I agree; others dress is not that critical. However, ignoring proper dress is often a sign of other inconsiderations such as shouting in the passageways, cutting in lines, interruptions, etc that DO affect me.

I have sailed Radisson with CCC and free kids. I know CCC is standard on Alaska and FP cruises. It was also the dress code LAST year in Bermuda. For some reason, Radisson changed to include THREE informal nights. I am concerned that Radisson is going after the young casual demographic with kids. If that is the case, I may feel the need to switch to another cruiseline. The only one that would fit the bill is Silversea and I cannot afford them once the current oversupply is solved.

Radisson lurker, please, please, realize that we like the civility of life aboard ship. Although the world is becoming a much more casual place, don't let the pendulum swing so far that you tolerate shirtsleeves in Compass Rose on informal nights and shorts and tennis shoes in show lounge during the evening. I know the formality of the US and Royal Navies and the formality of Ocean Cruising are gone forever, lets just try to retain some civility.

Denise-

I agree. Well said.

Denise, I really don't notice what others are wearing either! However, I would like Radisson to maintain the civility of the line by enforcing the dress code. If someone doesn't want to put on a coat on informal night, then they have alternatives for dining choices. I, too, have to wear business wear for work. When I go on a cruise, I enjoy going up a step on informal and formal nights, and down a step on CCC nights. Wouldn't think of bringing any of those suits onboard! (Well, maybe my trusty black pant suit!)

Marc, your comments about disregarding the dress code leading to other inconsiderations reminds me of an experience from the past. I was a chaperone on a field trip when one of my children was in the 5th grade, and we were at the Science Center in Baltimore. One of the guards told me that kids in uniform (our school required them) always acted orderly and he never had a problem with them. Maybe there is something about "dressing" that makes people (adults and children) act differently?

1) I won't travel again without my foam pillow(s) and my lightweight fleece blanket. There's one suitcase.

2) Mark's tux weighs a ton, and takes up a lot of space. Our "other MINT" is 10 nights, so we are going to have to cram a lot of stuff into our remaining three suitcases (plus, I'm sure to buy *something*). We'll also have to be careful of the weight.

3)I fell last year, and have been left with a problem with my left foot; really dressy shoes are problematic.

While we wouldn't dream of showing up in the dining room without being dressed appropriately, we are grateful for in-suite dining. We are also early-to-bed people, so we've never made it to a show. We want to go to Signatures and Latitudes both, so we will have appropriate clothes for those. But we'll skip any real formal nights simply because we need to.

Pam, You might be able to leave your foam pillows at home. I am partial to my foam pillow as well and when I requested them on my last cruise, they were the kind that you can bend in half.

I do understand and somewhat agree with some of the points you've expressed, Olivia and Marc. We do enjoy dressing up a bit, but don't go overboard in doing so. Our style is simple, but appropriate (at least in my opinion).

I must also say that I've seen people dressed to the nines who were rude and crude, as well. Well dressed sometimes does not equate to well mannered.

I do think that one needs to adhere to Radisson's dress code, as specified, if this is what is expected; however, where once I obsessed about what to wear, I no longer do. I no longer focus on what others are wearing, as well.

If someone is obnoxious, ill-mannered or slovenly, I steer clear, whether it be on-board or in my day to day living.

Some of the posts above express a fear that Radisson's dress code (whatever it is on a particular cruise) will be violated. Nothing in this poll, or in my position on the matter, advocates violating a dress code. The question is what the dress code should be.

Marc, I don't think that increased emphasis on informal nights signals a demographic shift to young people with kids. I'm 60 years old, and the informal code is my favorite. I dress within it even on casual nights (which is allowed), and so do many others. So many others (more than half of whom are 60+) that it seems to me that it is becoming the preferred code of Radisson guests. But I certainly agree that it would be a sad day to see guests in mass violation of the dress code on a Radisson ship.

Thanks,
Richard :) :) :)

Karen, we used three of Voyager's "foam" pillows, each, and while I was "okay" with them, Mark was miserable. Ours are the latex foam, and we are so addicted to them! I do think I'll just take one for each of us, though, and use Mariner's to pile on top. That would open up some luggage space, and several of the things I am taking are pretty light.

And I have to have my lightweight blanket; I'm at the age that I live a high-temperature life.

Very well put, Richard! We would never consider violating a dress code. I was merely expressing my feelings towards the dress code and preference for more "relaxed" attire. Not shorts, tank tops, etc. at dinner time. I'd just like to see more informal/CCC. This is our personal preference. However, whatever the dress code is, we will adhere to it.

Let me clarify here. I did not say that some people were dressed like slobs. Not at all. Even the gentlemen that appeared in the showroom in shorts and shirt on informal night was not dressed slovenly but he did stand out in a crowd. I said that some were dressed more casual then I expected. The majority were well dressed for the code of the evening and even more so. I know on one of the CCC evenings I had on a long black dress and my husband had on a jacket and tie. We just felt like dressing up that evening. I have to admit though, that it would be much easier packing and such if they made the dress code optional but stressed no shorts or bluejeans at anytime, anywhere, after 6:00 p.m. except maybe the gym or something.